It's Personal Stories, A Hospitality Podcast

Brian Quinn, Chief Development Officer, Sonesta International Hotels Interviewed by Rachel Humphrey

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Brian discusses why resiliency and learning to work through ambiguity are two critical leadership traits. He shares his strategies for managing business travel, balancing life, and adapting to new roles. He talks about engaging with mentors, public speaking, building networks, being active in industry associations, and what advice he'd give his younger self. 

Rachel Humphrey:

Good afternoon. I am Rachel Humphrey with DEI Advisors. We are a nonprofit organization dedicated to empowering personal success within the hospitality industry. And I am extremely excited to welcome to the show today, a longtime friend of mine and someone who will, we'll have no shortage of discussion today. Brian Quinn, the chief development officer for Sinesta International Hotels. Brian, welcome to the program.

Brian Quinn:

Thank you, Rachel. It's been great to watch all the great work you and your colleagues have been doing at DEI Advisors and becoming another great storefront for thought leadership in our industry and connecting all of us together to talk through different ways to help our companies grow, help our industry grow and hopefully attract new people and cast an even wider net for for the hospitality industry.

Rachel Humphrey:

Couldn't agree more. Thank you so much for saying that we're going to jump right in because, as I mentioned, we will have no shortage of conversation and a limited time today to do that. Everyone knows that 1 of the things I love the most about the hospitality industry is that no 2 paths are the same. You can really forge whatever that path looks like for your own leadership journey. So tell our listeners a little bit about your path. to where you are today. And then if there were really any most impactful moments along the way that you think really gave some direction to where you've ended up.

Brian Quinn:

Sure. I think like a lot of the audience, a lot of us start out in operations in the hospitality space as a function of, contributing to their family and helping manage expenses, during college and first jobs. But what was exciting to me pretty quickly was coming up through the ops track was, I think either people fall in love with the hospitality business or they find that it create, too demanding and too challenging. And they maybe press the exit button and and exit. I fell in love with it pretty quickly. I grew up in New York in a big Irish Catholic family. And as far as being extroverted a bit. That was survival in my big family. So it was interesting as I started to get into ops and I started out as a bellman how much I enjoyed interacting with the guests and owning a piece of their journey while they were with us. And that was really the first step. Wrong there for me, but one through line, if I think about all my ops experience was just being very open and saying, yes, a lot of the different parts of the business I got exposed to was because I had a great mentor or a a leader at the hotel that was willing to connect and reach out a little bit and spend a little bit of time. And then when they made the offer, I Do you want to come down into the liquor room and see how we do the the bottle for bottle exchange, or do you want to come into the kitchen and see how we store the food? So we manage our food costs, say yes. And I think when I talk to folks in our industry and outside of our industry, I think two things that helped me on those first couple of rungs of the journey was saying, yes, making yourself available and putting yourself in those situations. We had a food and beverage director that moved into our hotel. He was waiting to be relocated. And he was in the hotel a lot because he didn't have a home yet. So as the Bellman, you're in the hotel a lot. And with a little bit of downtime, built a little bit of a rapport and then got that exposure to the food and beverage side of the business, even though I was even though I was in in rooms, and on the Bellman side I think the other. piece that I saw as an accelerator for myself was the fact that I got in at 16, 17, 18 years old and started to build up a network and learn some of the acronyms and learn how the industry worked a bit and learn how, hotels made money in addition to taking care of the guests. It just helps you accelerate through all the stages. And as I matured in my education, changed over time. The, That foundation of having been there early and often and exposed to different parts of the business, I would say was an absolute critical thing to accelerate me, through the, through a lot of the ops experience specifically.

Rachel Humphrey:

I love the idea of saying yes to whatever opportunities come your way. And you've touched on a couple of really important themes. I want to turn maybe to two of them first. And one was saying that you had, a mentor or somebody who was exposing you to different opportunities or encouraging you talk a little bit about the importance of mentors, allies, and champions on your progression, but also How can people either seek out people to mentee or seek out people to serve as an ally or champion for them? What if some of your experience has been in that regard?

Brian Quinn:

Yeah I absolutely have to say that I'm blessed, lucky, right place at the right time. But all of those things, fall into place when you end up with a good mentor, they see themselves in you and you may not even realize. That they're seeing themselves in you, but when they make the approach, they give you a little bit more time. They pull you into a conversation. They ask about your aspirations. They see you conducting the role that you have now with some excellence and that is attracted to them. I always say react. If you're given that option, I said the, I said, say yes, but also begin to build a rapport, right? Begin to just use. All the human skills to create the connection as people get additional responsibility, part of their fuel for what they do. And it's something that you and I are careful to do is they want to mentor folks that are engaged, that are interested, that They see an a runway for and they see an opportunity for. So it's not just saying yes, but it's also engaging that person that puts the first offer out there. And then, like all bonding and rapport, find common reasons to be in touch, stay in touch, follow up find a way to help them with what they're trying to get done. And you'll see the mentorship, expand. And I think. Allies are mentors and other folks that are influential, whether it's at the property level, at the corporate level, and then into the executive level where I call it horizontal leadership, right? A mentor is really someone who's sponsoring you, right? And is helping you and is guiding you. When people move into ally or other people that play that ally mode are folks that they've recognized that they have an opportunity to help you. And you have a responsibility to them to help them with their agenda. And that is such a powerful skill to hone and use as you get ever increasing, responsibility. The tactical jobs in ops are a great proving ground. You learn so much about the guests and how the business works and drive and the passion that you need to find, you For this business. But as you take on more and more responsibility and you start getting work done through others and you start bumping into other parts of the either hotel operation or corporate operation. Those allies are critical. You need to be invested in their success and they need to be invested in your success and an ally can. Advocate for you in such a different way than you advocating for yourself. It just lands so differently with the other constituents inside a hotel or a corporation or in a leadership team that are critical for you to be seen as someone that can lead and someone that can take on additional responsibility. And then a champion. You can hope to find a few champions. I think of champions as that even higher level where they're emotionally and intellectually in every way invested in you. I've been very lucky to, just to call out three or four, Mark Johnson who was with with IHG for many years and signature. Unfortunately, he, Just passed away was incredible. He would call me in the middle of the night just checking on me in all different stages of my career to continue to encourage me and always offering to, always offering to help. Steve Porter from Hilton and IHG was just an incredible person and champion. He'd see in you. An opportunity or watch you manage a situation in a way and then reinforce it for you so that you had the fuel to be able to go do it over and over again. But I always think of one thing that he used to do for all of us that he was championing. If you were giving a speech, if you were giving a presentation, if you were on stage, it wasn't always about him being on stage. Even when you were on stage, he'd be in that front row. Always nodding, clapping. in the people that he try for. So I think seek out React and mirror the mentoring and use your bonding and rapport skills. Allies are everywhere, right? Whenever you can help some other constituent in the business be successful, you just add it to your army. And those allies are helping you when you don't even realize that they're helping you. And then champions, that's just, I hope everyone is lucky enough to find people like Mark Johnson and Neil Martin and Steve Porter. Neil Martin, interestingly enough, is the one who asked me to come and go into the food closet and go into the liquor room and go into the refrigerator and learn the F& B and why you don't put chicken on top of fish when you put Steak up on top and you put the vegetables even higher because you don't want to damage any of the food that's in the refrigerator. And we're still friends today, so

Rachel Humphrey:

that's incredible. No, I, first of all, I love the differentiation between the three terms for you, but also the. Take advantage of somebody trying to engage or provide opportunities. I think sometimes we are hesitant to do that because of the person's role. So it's so important what you said about how that people want to help. People want to train and support. And I love, I'm, I wanted to talk about something else, but I'm actually going to pivot now that you, brought up public speaking and having an audience. I think that's such a wonderful thing as a way to also elevate your career to know that you have supporters in that crowd. For most people, many people say that public speaking is one of the things that they think is their biggest hurdle to achieving the career growth that we're looking for. I have known you on that. Speaker circuit, probably since my first day in the industry, you are not wanting to shy away from a stage or accepting whether you're invited to speak or not. Tell me a little bit about did you always feel comfortable with public speaking? Do you have certain rituals that you go through? What would something maybe that would surprise people about your public speaking to?

Brian Quinn:

Yeah, I think it is. It's I surprised myself when I think about this topic. Again, big family extroverted personality. So if it's a topic I believe in and that I'm passionate about, I feel like I can, impart an answer and impart some knowledge. Public speaking though, really is an acquired skill. Everyone's a little anxious. We just had our Sinesta our first Sinesta joined up conference in Las Vegas at the end of May. And you always have some butterflies before, before you go out. But I agree. But before, before you even get to that stage, what I learned is you have to practice the people that we all admire, that are great speakers practice. Practice, you really wanna inhabit the speech. And I use a lot of little different tricks. I speak into my phone now. I used to be a recorder and I listen to it my own speech at night before I go to sleep when I'm in the car. Once you've refined it and gotten it pretty close to the delivery stage. I just listened to it. Practice in front of a mirror. A lot of people, a lot of people do that to try and catch your everyone has their sort of little tics, physical tics and word tics. I was very lucky. And with past employers and at Synesta where, and maybe not everyone realizes that, but when you're putting on the big conferences, there's a production team that helps you with the speech, there's teleprompter training, there's Mike and, earpiece training and there's, there's a production element to it. And that's something you have to get comfortable with. The first couple of times you do that, it's, it feels strange. But I had a great. Production coach that I had a problem with. And a lot of us have a problem with I don't know if this is completely acceptable today, but it was gentle and done with love, but there was a big jar of M& Ms. And if you said you got an M& M, thrown at you and after, practicing a couple of weeks you, you did not want to have the the and the M& M, thrown at you, but everyone has little different. Ways that they go through those experiences, but something that one of my mentors, Steve Porter imparted to me was that we all have anxiety before we speak, but you've been in this industry your entire life, right? Whatever the question is, you're going to be able to serve up an answer. That makes sense and has some resonance because it, this, this industry is where you've chosen to, to toil for your life. So have that confidence. Now it may not be the a plus answer that you wanted to get out. That was part of your narrative at that moment, or perfect for that audience at that moment. But it's going to be acceptable. And what that did for me is it just took. That little extra part of the pressure of the nervousness away. And then you can shift and use the nervousness as power, right? Nervousness means you make your mark and you pause and you make your points and you get through, right? And that little surge of adrenaline at the end gives you the energy. So you can transfer the, the passion always know your audience, try and do some research on your audience, And it's about them. It's not about you, right? You're trying to give a good delivery so you can empower them, encourage them get the knowledge transfer, to happen. And then what other just element of public speaking is physicality, right? There's, you can do too much with the hands. But you have, if you don't do some, you're not getting. The physical use of transfer. Also, I just happened to be six foot one and 240 pounds. I don't have to do much for emphasis, but sometimes people physically do have to, I have to be careful not to overemphasize because I'm already, a bit of a presence because of my physicality and my voice. So those are all things you learn through the production, elements, but practice find your. version of listening to it or version of doing it in the mirror. Maybe it's practicing with your person. Maybe it's practicing with people at work. Maybe it's changing the word usage, that the producer originally gave you. So there are words that you're passionate about. The other thing I tell people is when you're going to start a speech, there's the topic and there's the audience. but bring your story to it so you can deliver it with passion and confidence and really get the transfer of the points that you're trying to get across. And the best way to do that is with personal stories.

Rachel Humphrey:

I love the let your nervousness be your power. That's such a great line. And also really picking a topic, not saying yes to things that aren't a good fit because then you, like you said, you're able to answer whatever things may come your way. One of the things Brian and you and I have talked a little bit about this, that I have known you through many different roles in the industry. Some you chose a move, some you were acquired, some of your companies have been acquired. You follow, we hear all the time, people follow people. Talk a little bit about how that experience has shaped you, but also maybe some of the unique skills in adapting to a new team, a new company, a new role, whatever that may be as you've made those transitions over time.

Brian Quinn:

Yeah, I think when the transitions are planned. That's one strategic few things that we'll talk about. And when it's unplanned, we'll talk about a few, the power of having in a strong network allows you sometimes to react to the unplanned situations, and I think that's critical to be there for others when they may have an unplanned. Transition is critical because you may lend a hand and you may need a hand lend back to you. So I think those unplanned transitions, keeping your skillset fresh, being willing to modify your career trajectory for a minute in order to stay relevant and to keep learning that's critical. So in that unplanned space, it's really about all the work we should be doing on ourselves all the time. Being of purpose, continual education, putting yourself out there in the marketplace, both for your enterprise and for the industry and for yourself, helping others when they find themselves in an unplanned situation, reaching out. Sometimes it's just that phone call or just that small referral that puts somebody, back on track. So those skills are skills. We all need to be refining those skills. All the time. You and I have talked a lot of times in different projects that we've worked on together about resiliency and adaptability. When you have an unplanned change, you've got to find that resilience, right? And what gives you the resilience? It's that expertise in your craft. It's having that strong network. It's treating both your employees and your employer and your customers with respect, because that's who's out there going to help and help you, to your next journey. When I had the change through COVID with choice to an STR with Domio, that was really an interesting unplanned change for me, but it allowed me to learn another industry in STR. Get exposed to venture capital and P. E. And also was very topical. If you think about everything in that space in the S. T. R. Space and the Airbnb space. And interestingly enough, I was finishing up my MBA at the same time and did my capstone paper on Airbnb. But so that was an unplanned switch where I learned another industry. Multifamily and the STR space and also informs me today because of the crossover around the issues. With that, I think when it's planned I would tell people be super respectful of where you're leaving. You never know when all those relationships are gonna turn. back around. And I know probably culturally for you and I, it's a little different to change jobs as often as it is now, very acceptable in our industry and in all industries, right? I think what's the latest metric I saw is like three to five years where it was seven to 10 or 10 plus when I started. But I think that makes your exit Even more important because if that is the new rotation, then that means you're going to be running into your former colleagues and your former employees and your former bosses in their new roles or in your new role down the road. So leave your files at the office, hand off the relationships to the incumbent. Make the calls, do the transitions, send your computer back on time, cut up the credit card, send the cell phone back, all those things that everyone's you know, they're annoying and that, and then, maintain your integrity when you leave. There's a, there is a time when you can talk to the community that, that you left, have a nice healthy pause there so that your former employer knows that you're respecting it. And your new employer knows that, Oh, if there was ever a change, that's, that's the right way to do it because that rep, if you do it the wrong way, that reputation, will follow you. I think when you get to the new opportunity planned or unplanned, And you and I've talked about this many times to listen, listen. It is a struggle for me as a New Yorker and the youngest of six kids to be quiet and listen. But the kernels of your success are in what you hear that first 30 days. And then the senior leader that you're responsible to ask about your predecessor. What worked and what didn't work. Just those two things set you on the right path. And then it's a lot of the other things that we talked about. Start to find your allies, build your network, add value, push in volunteer for things, help other people with the projects that are part of their success so that they will get invested in your success.

Rachel Humphrey:

Such great advice about listening. But the other thing you touched on that's so true is despite how big the hospitality industry is at its core, it's very small. And as you mentioned, those relationships, you never know who you're going to be working with or for again, and with such high followership of so many people, you might end up back with teams that you were with earlier. As I knew we're going to run short on time.

Brian Quinn:

Can I make one point on that? Sorry. Yeah. I'm gifted right now. It's such a unique situation where I had worked at red lion at one time, right in my history. I had worked at IHG and they had sold quite a few assets to SVC, the parent of Synesta. And now I find myself in one of these situations where I'm like, I love all my children, but really I'm working on a lot of the hotels I'd worked on in the past. With a lot of the people I've worked up with in the past across brands that I had invested, a lot of a lot of time and treasure, and also doing it with great folks that I had worked. With, in the past, Keith Pierce and I were fierce competitors when he was at Wyndham and I was at IHG and Choice and and Red Lion. And John Murray was a client and now he's my CEO. So it's just incredible to your point about how small, the industry is and to have that rapport from those shared experiences in the past. Allows us to accelerate our ability to work together and bring some successes to synest I think.

Rachel Humphrey:

No, I love that. It's such a great example of it. All right. I'm going to go rapid fire through a couple of, a lot of content I want to cover with you and we're going to run short on time. Tell me the tricks of the trade, if you can quickly. On managing business travel. I'm guessing you probably travel 60, 70 percent of the time, most of the time, depending on the role. That's a lot for anyone to be away. Tell me what are some of the pitfalls to it and how do you make it successful for you?

Brian Quinn:

Yeah, I've approached the 40 week plus level in the last two years, probably tracking that way this year. Look, you've got to take care of yourself. Sleep is absolutely critical in order to be able to manage business travel because unexpected things are going to happen that are outside of your Control. And if you have fuel in the tank, that always helps. I was teasing before Rachel and I jumped on the on the screen. I have my three to me bags, and it's not a commercial for to me. It's just the brand I've chosen, but I have one that I'm unpacking one that I'm packing and one that's always being repaired. I had

Rachel Humphrey:

no idea.

Brian Quinn:

But how, and then, I've also got a little bit of Steve jobs in me. A lot of you will notice that I always almost always have a white shirt on. It is the same branded white shirt. And that creates speed and looks good and is socially and professionally acceptable almost all the time. But then I don't have to get confused in the closet on which which shirt you have to use. Look, there's a lot of great technology out there too. Both in what you wear and what you use to be successful on the road. The remarkable remarkable pad is my latest little tool. And it's a nice little thin piece that doesn't take up too much room in in your briefcase. Figure out your poison, whether it's audible or whatever your digital way to have entertainment on the road, whether it's reading a book. The less you bring, the better. Better because there's less that you're going to lose on the road. Multiple chargers because technology is absolutely key. I still bring my laptop on the road. I know a lot of my cohorts that are probably just on the age scale, a little or a little bit more gutsy to just bring the phone or the or the or the iPad. But get to the airport early. Things always go wrong. Some people like to go wait till the last second. I think the airport clubs are an incredible investment because if you get stuck. You continue, you can continue to get your work done. So there's a few,

Rachel Humphrey:

I think that you and I would be incompatible business travelers. I like to walk into the airport as they're boarding my flight and just hope that I'm going to get to the gate on time. All right, switching over quickly. You are incredibly active in addition to your corporate roles with various boards and associations, HLA, U S travel a Hoa, some of the other organizations within the industry talk for a brief minute about the impact, obviously in giving back and in networking and all of that, but how do you use or how have those opportunities helped you elevate your career path in ways that might be different from your corporate experience?

Brian Quinn:

Yeah, I think it's incumbent on all of us to Especially in this industry where there's so much of it is around human capital and taking care of people to be involved in the trade associations and be involved in the centers of gravity that can move public policy and move the industry, in a positive way. I've been incredibly lucky. I currently sit on the HLA board. Foundation board, but I served on the HLA board, the FRLA in Florida on the U. S. Travel and Tourism Board for the federal government, which it's sits inside the Commerce Department. Look you're managing a couple of things when you get into roles with responsibility. You're trying to make sure that there's a playing field for your enterprise to be able to be successful, that we're getting the balance right around our constituencies. Are we taking care of the consumer correctly? We're taking care of our employees correctly. And are these platforms for growth and are the returns there? That crosses over a lot of public policy, tax policy living wage policy, diversity issues. All of those are critical things. For those three constituencies that I called out to be successful. And by being involved with the trade associations and on the boards and being part of the public discourse across those allows you to influence them and to share the upside of our industry with the public policy officials and the trade folks, and also where the, where the risks are, you think about no room for trafficking as an example. This is part of the hospitality industry's duty of care, right? When we have guests staying with us, we need to be aware. We need to be caring for all of our guests. Public policy started to change in that area. We saw some risk for our industry. We saw the upside. If we got it right. We also saw the opportunity to help people, that were in trouble. And I always think of that one, because I think we fired on every constituency. It was a public, it became a public policy issue and also managed risk. We were doing the right thing and we would Doing well by doing the right thing and ultimately our job is to care for people, whether it's employees that may be in an emergency situation, or a guest and those kind of things, fill you up right? You're able to add value to the industry, have an important impact on your enterprise, give back and and I've been the receiver of. Minimum wage and how tips are handled and how the educational institute works and, all the training that we worked on together at a hollow. So I think it's something that I'm incredibly passionate about. It's something that I'll always be be a part of because I believe that we can have an impact. And look at the other thing is I think, the D's and the R's love our industry because we employ a lot of people. We pay a lot of taxes and we're, our industry is the American dream. You can start out as a Bellman and end up as the chief development officer or your family can own, a six unit motel and end up with hundreds of hotels down the road. And that's energy for both sides of the political landscape we live in right now.

Rachel Humphrey:

Yeah, that's so well put. I wanted to ask you about building relationships and networking. I'm not going to because you've touched on it in several of the other topics. But I did want to mention because everybody seems to love why I've asked somebody or how somebody has impacted my career. And Brian, I will tell you, it is no secret to you that from the day that we met very early on In my experience, those who know me know the giant conference is my least favorite place, but it is one of your favorite places from, without a deep relationship from the time I would walk into a room. There was Brian and his big personality and his big self always welcoming me. And so that immediately put the rest of me at ease in walking into scenarios that are not my favorite. And so I know that you're. Relationship building your networking is such a critical, important part of your career, but also of your personality and that ability to feel have everyone around you feel welcome. And part of it is such a really special gift. So I'm very appreciative of that. And I wish we could. Talk about it.

Brian Quinn:

I got to jump in for once again. First of all, thank you. And I am so thankful for our professional relationship and our friendship and that of your colleagues at DEI advisors. But this was something I saw a mentor do. And I said, what did you just do over there? And what this person shared with me is I feel very comfortable if I feel very comfortable in a setting whether it's a small setting and you're used to a big setting or a big setting you're used to a small setting, go find the person who may not be completely comfortable in the setting you're in. and pull them in. Go find doesn't look like everybo and pull them in. Go find pull them in. And I said, me process that. And they back for a moment when it you were invited in the l invited in the club or yo It changes the trajectory of that person's relationship with you one on one, but also how it gives them fuel and energy to be successful in those other circumstances. So networking is great. Sharing your network is even more important. And then using your reverse skill. You're also one of the people that I go find when I want a quiet corner and chill out for a minute, not be on stage that I can have a great conversation with, learn something, be with a friend, be with somebody that I care about. And we can talk about the things that matter. And that gives me energy too. So thank you.

Rachel Humphrey:

Now I want a secret handshake. So the next time I see you, that's the top of my list. Brandon, we wrap up just two more quick questions. One of the things, in addition to your journey to leadership, but I love to ask all of our guests. I think we are all works in progress. And a lot of that is reflecting on who we were, who we are becoming, who we want to be. Tell me what you would tell 21 year old Brian, either about how things end up for you or something you wish you knew earlier in your career that might've made an impact for you.

Brian Quinn:

The number one thing when I think about that question is if you have the opportunity to find your passion early. Find it and run towards it because it accelerates you through the potential for your career and also opens up all of these different doors that you may not have even realized were there. I got in early, 16, 17 years old, fell in love with ops, thought I was on an ops track. Ended up in a corporate owned hotel that was acquired by a British beverage company that put me on a completely different track, got exposed to a hotel in another market that exposed me to technology, which exposed me to corporate, which exposed me to franchise. And then development said yes, when we were doing an acquisition and learned, the real estate and finance side of the business. But what is the through line there? I got in early. I had, I knew the acronyms. I knew how the business worked and I could rely on that. I could call people and the exposure to those different parts of the business so fast. I think it was, it's just, a critical success factor for me. Balance. I won't say that I'm great at it. I think it's something we all have to be mindful of. We all have other interests in our lives that we have to nurture and take care of and people that we have to nurture and take care of. Unfortunately, my mom just passed away two months. I've got two kids in college that we were talking about. So you gotta be there for the other responsibilities in your life. And just remember you're always being watched. Be an example, be a beacon, right? We all know when something not right is going on. Get yourself out of that situation, right? Don't put yourself in that situation. Try and set the example. I probably would have gotten out of the lobby bar a little bit quicker, younger self for both calories, headaches, and energy level. Oh

Rachel Humphrey:

my gosh. All right. So as we are wrapping up. Thinking about the motto of DEI advisors to empower personal success. Tell me one last thing that you would offer to our audience. Something that, you'd like to share that might help empower their own success.

Brian Quinn:

Yeah, I would find the biggest definition of resilience that you can out there in your life. And continue to refine that muscle, right? I started when I started out in this industry, we had the resolution trust crisis, and we had to jump, off of that adventure. I lived through nine 11, the real estate crash COVID, right? Those are, were incredible shocks to our industry. And I look back and go, how the heck did we make it through? Resilience. And the last emergency is not going to be the same as the next emergency. So continuing to refine that resiliency, not just your own drive, but to in leadership, you have to grow a team that's resilient and be resilient for your colleagues. Pick your folks up when they need to be picked up, pick your colleagues up when they need to be picked up. Hey, how about this? Take something off your CEO's shoulders instead of just putting more Issues on their shoulder ambiguity. This is a tough one for me as a New Yorker. Sometimes I love black and white and I like where's the true north and we head towards it. As you gain more and more responsibility and as you get into big businesses that have multiple constituencies, you're going to have to sit in ambiguity. Sometimes there is no clear answer because there's multiple constituents that have different opinions and have different solution sets. And you're going to have to sit there for a minute and be successful there, be a good colleague there, still have an impact there. Until it resolves itself and don't let it steal your passion. Don't let it steal your resiliency. Just refine it as a skill that you're going to need as you move up. Because as you move up and through the industry ultimately you're going to run into ambiguity because there are different value drivers for different constituencies and different constituencies that have different needs.

Rachel Humphrey:

We've talked about that. That's one that I have to continue to develop as well. So

Brian Quinn:

I'm working on it.

Rachel Humphrey:

Brian, we are out of time. There's so much more. I know that I could ask and would love to have you have the opportunity to share. But on behalf of myself, the hospitality industry, thank you so much for all you do and give to the industry. Thank you for sharing your story for those in our audience who are listening. We hope you enjoyed Brian's advice today and that you'll head on over to DEIadvisors. org to hear from other hospitality industry leaders who have likewise shared their journeys and their insights as well. But Brian, thank you so much for joining us.

Brian Quinn:

Thank you, Rachel. And again, thank you to all your colleagues at DEI Advisors for what you do. And I think it's an incredible platform for us to continue to see our great industry thrive. Thanks

Rachel Humphrey:

so much, Brian.